Susanna Calkins, Author
  • Home
  • Lucy Campion Mysteries
    • A Murder at Rosamund's Gate
    • From the Charred Remains
    • The Masque of a Murderer
    • A Death Along the River Fleet
    • The Sign of the Gallows
    • The Cry of the Hangman
    • Death Among the Ruins
  • The Speakeasy Murders
    • Murder Knocks Twice
    • The Fate of a Flapper
  • Short Stories
  • Blog
  • News & Events
    • Event Photos
    • Archived Guest Posts & Interviews
  • The Roaring Twenties
  • 17th c. England
  • Writing Resources
  • Nonfiction
  • New Page

Question from the Reader Bag--How do English Nobles address each other?

8/15/2015

2 Comments

 
I received a query from a reader yesterday that gets at the many meddlesome and troublesome questions that writers of British historical fiction inevitably face--How do nobles address each other?
"...I just wanted to know: if the oldest daughter of an earl was going to soon be marrying the oldest son of another earl, how would they address one another? The setting is 1860s London, if this helps answer my question. I have read many websites and guide-books that explain how the peerage would be addressed by various people in various situations, but I am having trouble finding information about two people, both children of earls, who are engaged to be married. Would they be more casual with one another? Or would it be inappropriate to address one another without their appropriate title? Your help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you." --Maryam.
This is indeed a tricky question. I know something about the forms of address in 17th century England, but I didn't want to assume what was common or expected in the 1660s would be the same 200 years later, in the 1860s.  So I threw this question out to the lovely and talented Sleuths in Time, who have spent a lot more time than I have thinking about this question.

So, first, the basics.  According to Tessa Arlen: "The eldest daughter of an earl would be called Lady Susan; that would be the extent of her title until she marries. If she were to marry an ordinary man she would be called Lady Susan and then his surname: Lady Susan Blogs for example. The eldest son of an earl might be given an honorary title of his father's of a lower rank this would be given to him until he inherited his father's title. For example, his father who is Roger Parker, Earl of Bainbridge might bestow the honorary title of viscount on his eldest son. So the son's name and title would then be Denis Parker, the Viscount Lord Winslow. It is also important to remember that the Earl of Bainbridge would have a family name, in this case Parker."

This seems pretty straightforward so far, right?

Tessa continues: "I can't imagine why this young couple would call one anything other than by the first names when they were alone together. And if they are English the usual terms of endearment! If they were together out in society Lady Susan would be referred to as the Vicountess Lady Winslow and her husband would be the Viscount Lord Winslow and they would be announced as Lord and Lady Winslow. When Lord Winslow's father dies and he inherits the earldom he will become the next Earl of Bainbridge - and be called Lord Bainbridge and his wife would become the Countess of Bainbridge. The order of precedence can be very confusing - even for Brits. So tell your friend to follow this pattern and she will sound like she knows what she is talking about!"

Excellent advice!

Alyssa Maxwell also commented: "
Sometimes the son and heir would be called by his courtesy title without Lord in front of it, as in Brideshead or Bridey as friends and family called him in the book." She also directed us to Jo Beverley's Guide to English Titles in the 18th and 19th centuries, a very helpful resource!

As Anna Lee Huber further notes:
"In the case of an earl, he usually does have a lesser title (viscount or baron) he can grant his eldest son as a courtesy, but it's also possible he doesn't. (Author's choice since it's fiction.) In that case he would be called Mr. Parker by his fiancé in public, Denis in private. The rules for daughters & sons of earls are slightly different. Daughters of dukes, marquesses, & earls receive the honorary Lady before their first name. Only sons of dukes & marquesses receive the honorary Lord before their first name."

And to round us out, Ashley Weaver says, "I
have always found [Laura Chinet's] site really useful for reference. She has little charts and everything!" [I will say, however, that what Laura Chinet describes for the 18th and 19th century may be different from 17th century conventions. In my research, I have seen many letters between family members that use endearments, like "My dearest Anne." So it stands to reason that if they use such intimacies in written letters, they would do the same in private conversations. There is a formalization of speech and manners that happened in the mid 18th century that was not as pervasive in earlier centuries-SC].

Ultimately, in my opinion, this comes down to an accuracy vs authenticity kind of question.  I think writers of historical fiction should try their best to be as reasonably accurate as possible, but ultimately their focus should be on telling the best story possible, without jarring the reader.

2 Comments

Sleuths in Time, Tracking Crime

2/13/2015

2 Comments

 
Picture
 I'm delighted to say that recently a group of us--eight authors who write historical mysteries--joined together to form a new collective: Sleuths in Time, Tracking Crime. 

We write historical mysteries set in England, Scotland and the United States, ranging in time from the 1660s to the 1930s.  Connect with us on Facebook and Pinterest (Sleuths in Time Authors) or follow us on Twitter! (@sleuthsintime).

We've got some great things planned, including some giveaways and a scavenger hunt at Malice Domestic. Stay tuned for details!



Picture

Tessa Arlen writes a mysteries series set in the early 1900s featuring amateur sleuth Lady Montfort and her housekeeper, Mrs. Jackson.

Her first book in the series DEATH OF A DISHONORABLE GENTLEMAN was released January 6, 2015.
A Party For Winston, the second book in the series, is scheduled to hit the shelves January 2016. www.tessaarlen.com  Check out her blog too, The Redoubtable Edwardian. 

Picture

Picture
Susanna Calkins writes the Lucy Campion mysteries set in 17th century England. Her first novel, A Murder at Rosamund's Gate, was shortlisted for the Sue Feder Historical Award (Macavity) and her second, From the Charred Remains, was shortlisted for a Lovey and the Bruce Alexander Historical Mystery Award (Lefty).  Her next book will be released April 14, 2015! Counting down the days!

Picture

Picture

Anna Lee Huber
writes the Lady Darby series set in 1830’s Scotland, which features a gifted portrait artist with a macabre past, including instruction in anatomy. 

A Study in Death, the fourth book in the series, will be published by Berkley in July 2015. Other titles that follow the detecting exploits of Lady Kiera Darby and inquiry agent Sebastian Gage are The Anatomist’s Wife (nominated for RITA Awards and a Daphne du Maurier in 2013), Mortal Arts (Sept. 2013), and A Grave Matter (July 2014). 
To learn more, check out my 2013 interview with Anna too!

Picture

Picture
D.E. Ireland, writes the Eliza Doolittle and Henry Higgins mystery series in which the celebrated professor of Wimpole Street and the former Cockney flower girl join forces to solve crime in Edwardian London. WOULDN'T IT BE DEADLY has been nominated for the Malice Domestic Agatha Award for Best Historical Novel of 2014.

MOVE YOUR BLOOMING CORPSE will be released on Sept. 22, 2015 and continues the adventures at Ascot racecourse. Check out my interview, where they explain how they manage to write together without killing each other!


Picture

Picture
Anna Loan-Wilsey writes the Hattie Davish Mystery series set in 1890's America featuring a traveling secretary who solves crimes in every historic town she visits.

The upcoming Hattie Davish book A Deceptive Homecoming will be released by Kensington in July 2015. Earlier books in the series are A Lack of Temperance (Sept. 2012), Anything But Civil (Sept. 2013), and A Sense of Entitlement (June 2014). www.annaloanwilsey.com


Picture

Picture
Christine Trent writes the LADY OF ASHES series about a Victorian undertaker solving crimes that Scotland Yard cannot.

Full of details about funeral customs in the Victorian era, LADY OF ASHES was a 2014 Daphne du Maurier finalist, and the fourth book
in the series, THE MOURNING BELLS, releases on March 31, 2015. Christine's long-suffering husband is very understanding of her need for cats (5), books on shelves (4,000+ and counting), and scrapbooking supplies (don't ask).

Picture

Picture
Alyssa Maxwell writes The Gilded Newport Mysteries, set in Newport, RI, in the 1890s and featuring Emma Cross, a female society reporter who is a distant cousin of the Vanderbilt family. Kensington will release the next book in the series Murder at Beechwood in May 2015.

Previous series’ titles are Murder at the Breakers (March 2014) and Murder at Marble House (Sept. 2014). She officially became a
USA Today Bestseller the week of Sept. 4, 2014.

Picture

Picture
Ashley Weaver is a Louisiana librarian, unabashed bookworm, and the author of the Amory Ames Mysteries, set in 1930’s England.

The first book in the series, MURDER AT THE BRIGHTWELL, has been nominated for a 2015 Edgar Award for Best First Novel. The second book, DEATH WEARS A MASK, will be released on October 13, 2015.

Picture

2 Comments

    Susanna Calkins

    Historian. Mystery writer. Researcher. Teacher.  Occasional blogger.

    RSS Feed

    Categories

    All
    1660s
    16th Century
    17th Century
    18th Century
    1910s
    1920s
    19th C.
    20th Century
    21st Century
    A Death Along The River Fleet
    Advertisements
    Alcohol
    Alpha Reader
    Amazon Pre Order
    Amazon Pre-order
    A Murder At Rosamund's Gate
    Anagrams
    Anne Perry
    Anthology
    Art
    Authorship
    Award
    Awards
    Blogger's Block
    Blogging
    Blog Hop
    Blog Tour
    Bloody Good Read
    Bombings
    Book Events
    Book Giveaway
    Booksellers
    Book Trade
    Bouchercon
    Calendars
    Card Playing
    Caricature
    Cats
    Chambermaid
    Characters
    Charles I
    Charles Ii
    Charles Todd
    Chicago
    Chocolate
    Christmas
    Cia
    Cockney Slang
    Cocktails
    Coffee
    Coincidence
    Contemporary
    Cover Design
    Covers
    Creativity
    Crime
    Criminals
    Critical Thinking
    Cromwell
    Crossroads
    Csikszentmihalyi
    Cuckold
    Curiosities
    Defoe
    Detectives
    Detectives Oath
    Disease
    Dogs
    Early Modern
    Easter
    Editing
    Edwardian England
    Etymology
    Examples
    Excerpt Marg
    Excerpts
    Fairs
    Fate Of A Flapper
    Feedback
    Female Protagonists
    Female Sleuths
    Fire Of London
    Flow
    Food
    Forensics
    Forms Of Address
    French History
    From The Charred Remains
    Ftcr
    Future
    Games
    Gangs
    Giveaways
    Golden Hind
    Great Fire
    Great War
    Grit
    Guest Blogs
    Guest Interviews
    Guest Post
    Guest Posts
    Guilds
    Hanging
    Historical Fiction
    Historical Mysteries
    History
    Imagination
    Inspiration
    Interviews
    Ireland
    ITW Authors
    Jests
    Jewelry
    Language
    Last Dying Speeches
    Leisure
    Libraries
    London Bridge
    Lucy Campion
    Macavity
    Magistrate
    Malice Domestic
    Maps
    MARG
    Markets
    Masque Of A Murderer
    Matg
    Medicine
    Medieval
    Medieval Period
    Memory
    Merriments
    Merry-making
    Methodists
    Midwives
    Mindset
    Miscellany
    Monsters
    Moonstone
    Motivation
    Murder
    Murder At Rosamund's Gate
    Murder Ballad
    Murder Knocks Twice
    Mysteries
    Mystery
    Mystery Tv Shows
    Newgate
    Newspapers
    New Woman
    Nietzsche
    Nursery Rhymes
    Opera
    Orwell
    Persistence
    Pets
    Philadelphia
    Piracy
    Pirates
    Plagiarism
    Plague
    Poison
    Popular Film
    Popular Press
    Potions
    Printers Row Lit Fest
    Printing
    Private Investigators
    Proactive Interference
    Procrastination
    Prohibition
    Promoting Books
    Pseudonyms
    Psychology
    Publication
    Public Executions
    Publishing
    Punishments
    Puritans
    Puzzles
    Quakers
    Radio Shows
    Reader Questions
    Reading
    Receipts
    Reformation
    Rejection
    Religion
    Research
    Restoration
    Riddles
    River Fleet
    Samuel Pepys
    Scene Development
    Science Fiction
    Scold's Bridle
    Secret London
    Setting
    Seven Things
    Shakespeare
    Short Story
    Sign Of The Gallows
    Sleuths In Time
    Smithfield
    Speakeasy Mysteries
    Speech
    Spying
    Strange Things
    Teaching
    Thank You
    The 1640s
    The 1650s
    The 1660s
    Theater
    Thief-taker
    Timeline
    Titles
    Travel
    True Crime
    Tyburn Tree
    Valentine
    Wilkie Collins
    Winchester Palace
    Witches
    Women
    World-building
    Writier's Life
    Writing
    Writing Prompts
    Young Adult

    Archives

    February 2021
    January 2020
    December 2019
    August 2019
    May 2019
    April 2019
    March 2019
    February 2019
    September 2018
    November 2017
    July 2017
    June 2017
    May 2017
    November 2016
    September 2016
    July 2016
    June 2016
    April 2016
    March 2016
    February 2016
    January 2016
    December 2015
    November 2015
    October 2015
    September 2015
    August 2015
    July 2015
    June 2015
    May 2015
    April 2015
    March 2015
    February 2015
    January 2015
    December 2014
    November 2014
    October 2014
    September 2014
    August 2014
    July 2014
    June 2014
    May 2014
    April 2014
    March 2014
    February 2014
    January 2014
    October 2013
    September 2013
    August 2013
    July 2013
    June 2013
    May 2013
    April 2013
    March 2013
    February 2013
    January 2013
    December 2012
    November 2012
    October 2012
    September 2012
    August 2012
    July 2012
    June 2012
    May 2012
    April 2012
    March 2012
    February 2012
    January 2012
    December 2011
    November 2011

    RSS Feed

  • Home
  • Lucy Campion Mysteries
    • A Murder at Rosamund's Gate
    • From the Charred Remains
    • The Masque of a Murderer
    • A Death Along the River Fleet
    • The Sign of the Gallows
    • The Cry of the Hangman
    • Death Among the Ruins
  • The Speakeasy Murders
    • Murder Knocks Twice
    • The Fate of a Flapper
  • Short Stories
  • Blog
  • News & Events
    • Event Photos
    • Archived Guest Posts & Interviews
  • The Roaring Twenties
  • 17th c. England
  • Writing Resources
  • Nonfiction
  • New Page